Vesta engine and knocking hydraulic compensators: causes and solutions

What does the color of the exhaust smoke indicate?

The color of smoke from the exhaust pipe can be white, black, and other shades (depending on the additives in the fuel and the type of fuel itself). In this case, color serves as an important diagnostic sign and directly indicates malfunctions that have arisen in the engine. White smoke on a warm engine is 100% wear of the valve stem seals (determined by oil deposits on the spark plugs and (or) oil consumption) and (or) valve guides, and white smoke is also a sign of wear of the oil scraper rings of the engine piston group (checked by measuring engine compression) .

You can avoid costly repairs by promptly replacing oil seals, valve guides, and engine rings.

Rough operation of the engine at idle

The engine shakes (the gear shift lever shakes). Consequence of wear of the cylinder-piston group (pressure difference in the cylinders).

There may be malfunctions of the power supply system and (or) the engine ECU.

It can be eliminated by flushing the injector (cleaning the injectors), replacing high-voltage wires, spark plugs, ignition coils, or checking and adjusting the electronic engine control system (ESC) (you need computer diagnostics of the engine, determination of fault codes, and from them identification of a faulty engine ESC module (sensor) (in such cases, “CHECK” usually lights up).

If the power supply and (or) ignition system and ESU (electronic control system) of the engine are in order, then

Costly repairs can be avoided by timely replacement of engine rings. In this case, it is possible that the block is bored or the engine block is lined (in case of uneven critical wear of the cylinder).

Where does the knocking in the engine come from: how to find out

Specialists diagnose problem nodes by the nature of the knock, its tone and area of localization. A stethoscope is widely used for diagnosis. You can also make your own device for listening to engine knocks. To solve the problem, you will need a steel rod to which you need to solder a metal can. The bottom of such a container will effectively act as a membrane. To determine the cause of the knocking, the end of the rod is applied to various parts of the diagnosed internal combustion engine, while the can is pressed tightly against the ear.

The tone of the sound is an indirect sign, since on different engines the knock may appear louder or muffled. For example, the conventional knock of the crankshaft main bearings on a 1.4-liter Korean car may well be louder and easier to hear compared to the knock of connecting rods on a 3.0-liter German car. Often, the individual design features of each engine can cause a knock that has a different sound color, but the breakdown may be the same.

If we talk about diagnostics based on the nature of engine knocking, then it is worth highlighting a constant knocking, periodic knocking with one frequency or another, as well as occasional knocking. In the latter case, it is worth understanding the impacts that occur unevenly.

Engine knocking is usually associated with engine speed, that is, with the frequency at which the crankshaft rotates. The faster the engine spins, the higher the knocking frequency. The indicated frequency may or may not coincide with the crankshaft speed. It is also worth noting that the sound can become more or less intense (differ in strength) depending on the operating mode of the internal combustion engine.

For example, with an increase in the speed and load on the engine, there is a natural increase in the loads on the moving parts of the crank mechanism and the timing belt. In this case, the worn elements will knock more strongly than when the engine is idling.

At this stage, when diagnosing, it is important to determine whether the knocking increases with increasing speed. This often requires experience, since it is necessary to listen for knocking against the background of the general increasing noise of the operating unit.

In parallel with this, it is necessary to separately take into account the fact that the oil pressure in the engine lubrication system also increases with increasing speed. In some cases, the engine oil itself acts as a “damper”, and the knocking itself may become less intense even with increased load on the engine. For this reason, an important parameter is the temperature of the internal combustion engine. The engine may knock heavily when hot because the oil is diluted. At the same time, the knocking may hardly appear when cold. The opposite situation also happens when the engine knocks distinctly when cold, but after reaching operating temperature the noise disappears or is minimized.

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26 Reply from antifashist 2016-06-20 11:38:00

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Re: Engine clanging

What kind of boxes do you have? It has already been said somewhere that this is a characteristic “Loganov” zing or “zen” that must be accepted/understood.

27 Reply from Patriot 2016-06-20 16:07:46

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Re: Engine clanging

antifashist , This is a Renov catalytic converter

28 Reply from alexis 2016-06-21 05:21:47

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Re: Engine clanging

Can you be more specific?

29 Reply from valery151064 2016-06-21 17:44:40

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Re: Engine clanging

Box - mechanics. Same nonsense. When starting the engine, a metallic ringing sound can be clearly heard. I wanted to go to the service, but I heard that the neighboring Vesta started up in the same way - I calmed down.

30 Reply from Patriot 2016-06-21 18:12:23

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Re: Engine clanging

In Renault, the same thing happens when it’s cold, this disease migrated along with the catalyst. Kill it, measure yourself, be patient

31 Reply from Willis 2016-06-21 22:43:52

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Re: Engine clanging

32 Reply from alexis 2016-06-22 05:55:22 (2016-06-22 06:43:56 edited by alexis)

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Re: Engine clanging

Yeah, exactly this ringing, just like in the video. Can anyone explain the nature of the ringing? Hit? Bias? I was at the OD the day before yesterday. When hot, the sound does not appear. They tugged the exhaust system back and forth and spread their hands.

33 Reply from Willis 2016-06-23 18:07:51

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Re: Engine clanging

Most likely there is something jingling in the catalyst, the sound is coming from the engine compartment, and not from under the bottom.

34 Reply from Patriot 2016-06-23 18:42:10

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Re: Engine clanging

Most likely there is something jingling in the catalyst, the sound is coming from the engine compartment, and not from under the bottom.

Absolutely, there is some kind of partition there, the cold gap has been enlarged, so it makes this sound

35 Reply from Kabukibuka 2016-07-13 14:19:16

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Diagnosis of a malfunction based on the nature and location of sound

Extraneous knocking noise in the engine

The biggest concern is caused by extraneous knocks in the engine, which have a different nature, tonality, and frequency. They can appear at the bottom of the engine, in the middle, at the top. The sound can be dull or ringing with a metallic tint. It may appear when the engine starts and disappear after it warms up. The knocking may be loud, or it may be quiet, muffled. Since the operating principle of a diesel engine is fundamentally different from the method of formation and ignition of the working mixture of a gasoline engine, the sound of a running engine is completely different. The gasoline internal combustion engine has a soft, subdued, very quiet, uniform sound; for a diesel engine it is gurgling, of different tones, of medium volume. Extraneous sounds in a diesel and carburetor power unit may have the same origin (in the connecting rod and piston group, valves, camshaft, etc.), but have a different sound.

Causes of knocking noises

Causes of knocking in the engine

Knocks in the engine can occur for various reasons. The rationale for this thesis is very simple. The power unit consists of many moving parts that are subject to various mechanical loads and high temperatures. Moreover, the loads are constantly changing. The frequency of change depends on the number of revolutions of the crankshaft. Most often, these sounds appear in the power unit for the following reasons:

an increased gap has appeared in the mates as a result of natural wear - the life of the mating parts has expired and they must be replaced;
the inept actions of an inexperienced driver led to a gross violation of the engine operating rules - overheating, afterburner, use of motor fuel of inadequate quality, etc.;
poor-quality engine repairs were carried out with gross violations of technical regulations or defective non-original spare parts were installed.

Knocking or detonation. Signs and differences

Detonation in the engine of any technical vehicle, including the Lada Granta Sedan/Liftback, is similar to a small explosion with a shock wave. It is at the moment of explosion that the valve(s) knock.

The clattering noise is not always associated with faulty valves. It is necessary to conduct a thorough diagnosis followed by replacement of worn elements.

Signs of detonation:

vibration increases as engine speed increases;
black smoke from the vehicle exhaust system;
a sharp decrease in engine power;
frequent increase in operating temperature to a critical level.

If the knocking noise occurs when the engine is “hot,” then the reason is insufficient engine oil level.

Causes

If you conditionally divide the reasons, you will get two types - “easy” with which you can drive and “difficult” - after which your engine may not start.

Light knock

Mainly associated with engine wear or improper operation.

1) Oil. If you select the wrong oil, knocking noise may occur.

2) Valves or hydraulic compensators may make noise.

Valve adjustment occurred mainly on older engines, for example on classic VAZ (from 2101 to 2107). In modern front-wheel drive models, the adjustment is automatic and occurs thanks to compensators, but they do not last forever, if they do not work, the engine will run noisily - we just change them.

3) Wear of the timing system. They can be either the rollers themselves (tensioners or guides), the whole point is that they have a bearing inside, which can fail over time - applicable to a system with a belt. And the chain can also knock, due to the fact that it is simply stretched, this happens, for example, on some TSI modifications. There is such a thing as a diesel engine, watch the video for information.

4) Development of the camshaft, valves, “pastel”. Knocking appears due to these reasons. The shafts, their fastenings, and the valves themselves wear down over time, and therefore operate noisily. This usually happens on a fairly worn engine.

The list can go on for quite a long time, there are cases that are out of the ordinary - this is water or sand getting into the lubricant, you also did not change the oil filter when changing the oil, but it is already clogged, etc.

All these causes of knocking are, in principle, solvable and with fairly “small” means. Usually it’s worth changing the timing system and the noise goes away. BUT there are knocks that indicate the death of your unit, and if you do not give them due importance, then it will simply break down completely. I classify them as difficult cases.

Complex knock

Well guys, there are also several reasons here and they are more difficult to eliminate. Some, it’s true, may be outside the block, but they are also at a high level in importance, I’ll start with them.

1) I had such a case in practice when a new VAZ 2114 knocked when starting up just horribly! The symptoms are as follows: turn the key and a metallic clanging sound of unknown origin occurs. An acquaintance got scared and called me; the car had only 1600 km on it. By the way, many people experience such a clanging noise on new cars, so guys, it’s not the engine – it’s the crown of the flywheel. When you try to start the engine, the starter, with its small gear, tries to spin the flywheel, and it also has teeth. Sometimes these teeth (crown) are poorly made or hardened and are frankly defective. Then the starter gear simply breaks them, and you hear a metallic grinding sound when starting. The flywheel needs to be changed! However, the process is labor-intensive - they remove the transmission to get to it.

2) Loose connecting rods. The connecting rod goes with the crankshaft, but it is attached to it through a detachable connection, which, as it were, covers the attachment point. It sits on two bolts; if one is not tightened, a distinct knock will be heard.

3) The piston itself breaks. Previously, this practically never happened, but now, due to the use of lightweight options, they appear much more often.

4) The most “terrible” knock refers to the crankshaft (CV). It lies in the block in special places. But it is not located entirely on the walls; special gaskets are placed under it - liners. They are made of very durable metal, and seem to cover the HF from above and below, in other words, two hemispheres. They are installed very firmly and the crankshaft cannot come out of them. So, it’s rare, but it happens that these “inserts” are screwed. This happens due to high wear or poor quality material. And then the liner begins to rotate along with the HF, the knocking will be terrible! However, it often gets stuck! The damage is very serious, you need to disassemble the engine, remove the crankshaft bearings, etc., the cost will be high. Here is an example of a broken bed.

4) Wear of the support liner. It supports the crankshaft from the front, that is, it holds it so that it does not go horizontally, and when worn, it will exhibit a strong knocking sound.

From the editor

We have repeatedly told what owners of new cars with problems should do. Here is one of the latest cases. But let us remind you once again, citing the necessary points of legislation, namely the law on the protection of consumer rights:

Article 20. Consumer rights in case of sale of goods of inadequate quality

11. If a dispute arises between the consumer and the seller (manufacturer, supplier, representative) about the presence of defects in the goods and the reasons for their occurrence, the seller (manufacturer, supplier, representative) is obliged to conduct an examination of the goods at his own expense in the manner established by the Government of the Republic of Belarus. The consumer must be notified in writing about the place and time of the examination.

12. In the event that defects in the goods are discovered by the consumer during the warranty period, the seller (manufacturer, supplier, representative) is responsible for the defects in the goods unless he proves that they arose after the seller transferred the goods to the consumer as a result of his violation of the established rules for the use, storage, transportation of goods or actions of third parties or force majeure.

Article 22. Free elimination of defects in goods by the seller (manufacturer, supplier, representative, repair organization)

1. Detected defects in the product must be eliminated by the seller (manufacturer, supplier, representative, repair organization) free of charge and immediately. If it is not possible to eliminate the defects of the product immediately, the maximum period for their elimination cannot exceed fourteen days from the date the consumer submits a request to eliminate the defects of the product . By written agreement with the consumer, this period may be increased, but not more than thirty days.

Finding the source of the knock

The first step when the engine knocks is to find the source of the extraneous noise. The primary task of the car owner is to find the node where this unpleasant and uncharacteristic sound for a working car is formed.

Professionals can determine the source of the problem based only on the tone and approximate location. For diagnostic purposes, it is extremely useful to have a stethoscope in your arsenal of tools. Also, some craftsmen make homemade devices for wiretapping.

But here it is worth understanding that tonality is considered only an indirect sign, since noise on different engines with the same malfunctions can manifest themselves differently. The design features of the power unit should be taken into account, and the breakdown should be diagnosed not by sound, but by a comprehensive check.

Based on the nature of the extraneous knock, it can be divided into several categories. Namely:

permanent;
periodic;
with different frequencies;
episodic.

In the case of episodic tapping, they should already be called impacts that occur unevenly.

There is often a direct connection between the knock that appears in the internal combustion engine and the revolutions made by the crankshaft. The faster the engine starts to spin, the more intense the knocking occurs, and its frequency becomes higher. The frequencies sometimes coincide with the frequency of the shaft, or are different, which makes it easier to hear uncharacteristic noise. Depending on the current operating mode of the motor, the intensity may vary.

When the speed increases and the load on the engine increases, the load on the components of the crank and gas distribution mechanism increases in parallel. Then the worn parts will correspondingly knock with greater force and intensity than when the engine is idling.

And here it is important to notice whether the noise increases as the speed increases

Do not forget that as the engine speed increases, the oil pressure in the lubrication system increases. And here the lubricant can act as a damper, which reduces the intensity of sounds, even when the load on the internal combustion engine increases. Therefore, when diagnosing, it is necessary to simultaneously take into account the current engine temperature. When the engine is hot, the knocking noise may increase as the oil becomes thinner. And on a cold internal combustion engine, knocking may not appear at all. Or the opposite situations happen.

Detailed diagnostics: structural component of knocking

Guided only by a thermal sign, it will not be possible to find out exactly why the hydraulic compensators are knocking. An additional set of tests is required. Its essence is to analyze changes in the acoustic design of the Vesta engine, changing the speed and taking into account the temperature of the coolant.

Operating with revolutions

The testing stages boil down to analyzing the operation of the motor in various modes:

A knocking sound when cold or hot, which disappears at high speeds, indicates wear of the ball valve of the hydraulic module or its clogging with wear products. Option No. 1 - change the oil and oil filter to ones known to be suitable for the 129 engine. As a last resort, replace substandard hydraulic compensators.
A clattering sound exclusively on a hot engine, which goes away with increasing speed, indicates a critical condition of the plunger pair. It can only be eliminated by replacing the compensator assembly.
Tapping noises are heard only at high speeds, regardless of engine temperature, and at idle the engine operates smoothly - check the oil level. It is advisable to fill slightly above the average dipstick level, without exceeding the MAX mark. A damaged oil pickup has a similar effect.

If the knocking sound of the hydraulic compensators appeared immediately after replacing the oil composition on Vesta, it means that the lubricant was selected incorrectly, or the quality of the oil filter leaves much to be desired. Although the owners of the new Lada did not carry out major work on the engine, it is still worth knowing that after replacing the pushers, they may knock for the first few minutes. Then the noise goes away and does not appear again.

Consequences of ignoring a fault

The main prerequisite for troubleshooting is intrusive extraneous noise. Few people know what the real danger of tapping is. Excessive clearances in the timing belt affect the operating mode of the cams: the resulting shock loads significantly reduce the service life of the crankshaft.

How to eliminate the knocking of hydraulic compensators on Lada Vesta using auxiliary means

The manufacturer sets the service life of hydraulic compensator mechanisms for the entire period of operation of the motor. There are no routine maintenance activities for these units. By filling in high-quality lubricating fluid and knowing how often to change the engine oil, problems with hydraulic tappets can be avoided.

Use proven lubricant

At the first appearance of knocking, attempts are often made to change the oil composition. Well, the action is justified both when recording the fact immediately after replacing the emulsion, and as an early prevention of coking of hydraulic pushers

It is important not to deviate from the factory viscosity standards:

But this is not enough. A good product will be one that, according to reviews, is problem-free for the VAZ 21129. Since the development is still young and little technical information has been collected on oils, you can use the database for 126 and 127 sixteen valves. For example, Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 was not suitable for them. Among the optimal lubricants were the following:

Liqui Moly Optimal Synth.
Mobile Ultra.
Total Quartz Energy 9000.
Wagner Windigo.

Additives

Additional auto chemicals are not used as the main solution to the problem. Its task is to delay repairs by several thousand km. Accordingly, it is advisable to use this method only in case of wear or damage to the expansion joints. Liqui Moly Hydro-Stossel-Additiv and XADO products can be considered as additives.

Flushing

It is appropriate to carry out flushing activities when it is detected that the hydraulic compensators are coked or clogged. Only a local wash, not a general one, will help remove the knocking noise of contaminated hydraulic compensators on the Lada Vesta. The oil emulsion is poorly pumped through hydraulic pushers, hence the low efficiency of complex flushing.

The following liquids can be used to wash away carbon deposits and remove foreign products:

Dimexide.
Acetone + kerosene (2:1).
Solvent.
Any washing takes five minutes.

Source

AVTOVAZ's response to corrugation and muffler

Questions to AVTOVAZ regarding the problem in the operation of the Vesta exhaust system were asked live on “Ladnaya Mechanica”:

Question

: On Vesta, the exhaust system growls in 1st, 2nd, 3rd gears around 2000 rpm, as if the corrugation does not work and does not dampen vibrations.

Answer

: Perhaps this problem is individual. Perhaps there is a contact somewhere on the body causing a hum. Show your vehicle to a warranty engineer.

Question

: Everyone's exhaust howls around 3000 rpm. Most people digest corrugations.

Answer

: If you have a specific problem with a specific vehicle, please contact your dealer. If the problem cannot be solved, the presenter suggested writing about it in a PM, indicating the VIN of the car and the dealer where you are being serviced.

Knock - connecting rod bearing - Big Encyclopedia of Oil and Gas, article, page 1

Knock - connecting rod bearing

The knocking sound of the connecting rod bearings (dull knocks) is heard throughout the entire height of the block and disappears when the fuel supply is reduced. It appears as a result of wear of the crankshaft bearings and connecting rod journals.

The knock of the connecting rod bearings is sharper than the knock of the main bearings. It is heard when the engine is idling with the gear shift lever in neutral and intensifies with increasing crankshaft speed. The knocking of connecting rod bearings can be easily determined by disconnecting the spark plugs one by one by removing the tips with high-voltage wires from them.

The knock of connecting rod bearings is somewhat different than that of main bearings. It is usually rhythmic, mid-tone and the zone 2 listening is slightly higher than the main bearings. The knocking noise of connecting rod bearings increases significantly with increasing load. It can also be eliminated by replacing the liners at a service station.

The knock of connecting rod bearings is sharper than that of main bearings. It can be heard at idle and depends on the engine speed. To determine which bearing is faulty, you need to turn off one of the cylinders in turn, removing the high voltage wire from the spark plug. The reasons that cause knocking of connecting rod bearings are similar to those stated above.

Typically, connecting rod bearing knocks have a metallic tone that is harsher than main bearing knocks. The knocking sound is heard when the engine is idling and when the gearshift lever is in neutral position and intensifies with increasing engine speed. The knocking of connecting rod bearings can be easily determined by turning off the spark plugs one by one.

Usually the knock of the connecting rod bearings is sharper than the knock of the main bearings. It can be heard when the engine is idling when the throttle is opened sharply.

When fuel burns in engines with a high compression ratio, knocking noises reminiscent of connecting rod bearings are observed.

A dull knock that increases with a sharp increase in crankshaft speed is a sign of wear on the main or connecting rod bearings. The knock of the connecting rod bearings is somewhat less powerful than the main ones, and is heard through the wall of the cylinder block in the areas corresponding to the upper and lower positions of the crankshaft cranks.

This knocking indicates an increased clearance in the bearing and is detected when there is a sharp change in the engine crankshaft speed.

The knock of the connecting rod bearing, usually less powerful than the knock of the main bearing, is heard through the block wall in the area corresponding to the upper and lower positions of the piston pin. The appearance of a knock in the connecting rod bearings also indicates an unacceptable increase in the gap between them and the shaft journals. The knock of the piston pin is heard in the upper half of the cylinder and through the cylinder head.

An experienced driver can distinguish a knock when the main bearings are worn from a knock when the connecting rods wear. It is usually rhythmic, sonorous, metallic, and mid-tone. The knocking noise of connecting rod bearings increases significantly with increasing load, and disappears when the ignition is turned off. Eliminate the knocking of connecting rod bearings by replacing the bearings.

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www.ngpedia.ru

Crankshaft knock

The crankshaft can knock on both gasoline and diesel engines. This sound is heard from the bottom of the engine; in the interior of a warm car, the shocks appear on the left side.

This phenomenon is caused mainly by the depreciation of the crankshaft bearings, as well as the occurrence of openings relating to them. Depreciation is facilitated by engine overheating, low-quality oil or oil containing debris, as well as an insufficient amount of this fluid. In turn, openings are formed due to:

wear of the crankshaft journals or deformation of the inner wheels of the bearings;
insufficient amount of oil in the bearing or in the engine in general;
damage to the shaft journals due to repairs or improper storage of the part;
irregularly shaped shaft journals;
presence of water in oil.

Well, a bearing gap that has reached 0.07 mm means that the car requires repair, and urgently.

The first alarm bell in the form of a dull knock can be heard already when starting the engine. After all, the oil has not yet warmed up and has not reached the crankshaft bearings. Afterwards the knocking subsides, but sometimes appears at idle. While the revs are low, the sound is muffled. But when they are recruited, the blows also become louder.

However, it is not so easy to determine on your own what exactly the crankshaft is knocking. Here it is recommended to follow the universal rule, according to which a knock in the engine is a signal for urgent delivery of the car to the workshop.

Problem

As sad as it is to realize, West owners are not spared this problem either. Many owners notice knocking noises under the hood of the Lada Vesta, and they come from the right side.

As a rule, you don’t have to search for long, since the situation is well known. It appears on sedans that were equipped with engine mounts from the VAZ 21129. As a result, a whole cacophony of sounds began to be heard from the engine compartment, including knocks, clicks, squeaks, etc. Moreover, these sounds are so loud that they can be heard even in the cabin.

The knock from the support is quite loud

And the best confirmation of this is numerous videos in which owners of the domestic model demonstrate trouble.

And in this video you can hear knocks directly inside the car.

In addition, some owners began to “dig deeper” and found out that a similar situation occurs not only on Vesta, but also on other models of the Renault-Nissan Alliance. In particular, on the Nissan Qashqai. This is also confirmed in the video.

What is engine knocking?

The appearance of engine knocking in most cases indicates that in the area of mating of certain parts there has been a critical increase in the gaps between the elements. If the engine lubrication and cooling systems are functioning normally, then noise and knocking begin to appear at clearances that, on average, are double or more times the permissible parameters. The strength of the knock directly depends on how much the gap has increased. It turns out that knocking in the engine is the impact of parts against each other, the load at the point of contact increases significantly. In this case, wear of parts occurs much faster.

The rate at which further wear increases will depend on the size of the gap, materials of manufacture, load, lubrication efficiency and a number of other factors. For this reason, some components can go through tens of thousands of kilometers with a knock without serious consequences (the timing belt), while others (CVM and CPG) can fail after just a few kilometers. In some cases, the engine may knock even if the clearances are normal and there is no serious wear on the parts. This knocking noise can be caused by:

detonation and heavy loads on the internal combustion engine;
distortions of parts inside the engine;
jamming of individual elements;
loss of protective and other properties by motor oil;

And what an “appetite”!

Back in September 2022, at the height of events, so to speak, suspicions arose that the fuel consumption in my Lada Vesta did not meet the standards stipulated by the factory. My combined cycle consumption is 11.2 liters per 100 kilometers. Seems like a lot for a 1.6 engine, in my opinion. And since I had to “by chance” communicate with the dealer quite often, I decided to formally request information by writing the following statement:

I can’t comment here - just read the official answer:

It turns out that the official dealer does not have data on fuel consumption standards for the car they sold? This happens. Not expected. But I wasn’t asking specifically about my “special” car, as follows from the statement, but about what, in principle, fuel consumption rate per 100 kilometers was set by the manufacturer for all cars of this make and model. In general, if you want to know about fuel consumption, then it’s not the seller, but you need to contact some institute.

Law on the Protection of Consumer Rights Article 7. Information about goods (works, services)

1. The manufacturer ( seller , supplier, representative , performer) is obliged to promptly provide the consumer with the necessary and reliable information about the goods (works, services) offered, corresponding to those established by this Law, other acts of legislation, technical regulations of the Customs Union, technical regulations of the Eurasian Economic Union and requirements usually imposed in retail trade, consumer services and other types of consumer services for the content and methods of providing such information. For certain types of goods (works, services), the list and methods of communicating information to the consumer are established by the Government of the Republic of Belarus, unless otherwise established by the President of the Republic of Belarus.

Realizing the futility of my aspirations, I wrote the following directly on the control certificate form for the work order on January 21, 2020:

“I agree with the serviceability of the brake system. I request a technical examination of my car to determine the origin of the “unbearable howling” when braking when reversing. When contacted, the service does not answer this question.”

I'm still sitting and waiting. In the meantime, when I drive in reverse, passers-by turn around and are perplexed, but I feel somehow ashamed. It’s a pity that it’s just me.”

Engine knock. How to determine what is knocking and what to do about it?

Any incomprehensible sounds in the engine cause anxiety and worry in a good car owner, because the engine is the most complex and expensive part of the car and in the event of a breakdown, simple repairs in the garage are not enough. The fiery heart of a car always requires increased attention and timely maintenance.

Experts call the main, most common breakdown a knock in the engine. The reasons for its occurrence:

Knocking noise due to worn parts. Wear of the component mechanisms increases the gaps in the interfaces between the combined parts, which causes mechanical noise.

A distortion of the components is also possible. This occurs due to the installation of non-original components.

Using the motor with increased loads and exceeding engine speed, overheating.

Late oil change or insufficient quantity.

You can determine knocks yourself using the following parameters:

1. Impact power. While the engine is running, if the impacts have a loud, intense knock, you must immediately contact a service station, and the car should not move on its own. You need to call a technical assistance vehicle. If the impacts are heard only slightly, then the driver may risk taking the car for repairs himself.

2. Frequency and quality of sounds. They are voiced and deaf.

3. Frequency of impacts. May be random or coincident with the operation of the motor.

Experts also identify knocking in the engine during cold and hot operation. The noise is audible when the engine is cold, but after warming up the noise disappears. This happens when the pistons in the cylinders work poorly.

In another embodiment, knocking appears only when the engine is fully heated. This occurs when the crankshaft or piston system mechanisms fail.

It is not always possible to correctly and quickly determine the cause of a knock in the engine on your own, so a timely visit to a car repair shop will help to avoid troubles in the operation of the machine’s mechanisms.

Source

Briefly about the causes and methods of eliminating knocking

The knocking sound of the hydraulic pushers after a long period of parking, which disappears after 1-2 seconds, is not a malfunction.
Tapping on cold and hot, disappearing with increasing speed - the hydraulic compensator is dirty or the check valve ball is worn out. Eliminated by cleaning or replacement.
A clattering sound only on a hot engine indicates wear of the hydraulic compensator parts. The only solution is to replace the compensating mechanism assembly.
Knocks at high speeds - check the oil level and the integrity of the oil receiver.
A constant knocking noise suggests that there is a gap between the cams and compensators. It can be eliminated either by cleaning or replacing faulty pushers.
A knocking noise after an oil change is due to an incorrect oil composition or a defective filter.
Additives have a temporary effect, and flushing is effective only in a local format.

Gearbox faulty

The source of knocking noises when the engine is idling does not necessarily have to be in the power plant itself. This could be, for example, a gearbox. You can find out whether the gearbox is knocking or something else using the following method:

With the engine running, depress the clutch pedal;
If the knocking stops, the fault lies in the gearbox.

Conclusion

There are many reasons for a knocking sound in the engine when idling. Even experienced specialists are not always able to recognize which part is knocking without diagnostics. The desire of car enthusiasts to save money is understandable, but trying to fix the problem on their own can lead to a major overhaul or even replacement of the engine. So if it is not completely clear what to repair, how and with what, then it is better to take the “sewing machine on wheels” to a car service center. Let them listen there.

Video about knocking in the engine:

How to eliminate the knocking of hydraulic compensators on Lada Vesta using auxiliary means

Use proven lubricant

It is important not to deviate from the factory viscosity standards:

0W-30 (-40…+25)°C.
0W-40 (-40…+30)°C.
5W-30 (-30…+25)°C.
5W-40 (-30…+35)°C.

Liqui Moly Optimal Synth.
Mobile Ultra.
Total Quartz Energy 9000.
Wagner Windigo.

Additives

Flushing

Removing the valve cover on the 129th engine is not easy, and for local washing, access to the hydraulic modules is a necessary condition. A defective compensator either has a constant gap, or is pressed much easier than others with a wooden wedge resting on the non-working surface of the cam.

The following liquids can be used to wash away carbon deposits and remove foreign products:

Dimexide.
Acetone + kerosene (2:1).
Solvent.
Any washing takes five minutes.

Replacing hydraulic compensators

To replace the hydraulic compensators, the engine will have to be removed from Vesta - this will be a preliminary stage of repair. Before doing this, relieve the pressure from the fuel pipes and remove the negative terminal from the battery. In total, during the preparation process you will have to do the following:

drain the coolant, coolant, and oil from the gearbox;
remove the resonator, intake manifold protection, hose connected to it, air filter, adsorber, wheels, engine mudguard;
disconnect the wires from the oil pressure sensors, control lamp, crankshaft, air temperature, oxygen (there are two of them!), coolant temperature, throttle pipe, reverse gear, ignition coils, injector wiring harness;
with manual transmission: disconnect the pipes from the hydraulic drive and hang the cylinder on a hook, disconnect the cable tips from the gearbox levers;
with air conditioning: place plugs in the pipelines;
disconnect the starter traction relay and remove it, turn off the thermostat, remove the additional muffler and gasket, subframe, bracket, wheel drive joints and axle gears;
Remove the engine mounts and place the engine on a stand.

Prepare for work a probe to adjust the position of the hydraulic compensators on the Lada Vesta. Continue working with the motor removed:

remove the camshafts, remove the hydraulic compensators from their seats;
Replace damaged hydraulic pushers with new ones, adjust their position with a special feeler gauge.

Engine ring alignment

The cause of stuck engine rings is natural wear of the oil scraper rings, low-quality fuel and oil, especially its irregular replacement. Also, the reason for the occurrence of rings can be a long pause in engine operation, engine overheating, or low oil pressure.

You can try to “treat” the occurrence of rings by decoking. Helps in cases where the occurrence does not entail serious consequences associated with breakage of rings and destruction of the piston and (or) cylinder surface (the occurrence of scuffing, scratches and increased wear of the cylinder). An example of the occurrence of rings, which “cannot be treated” by de-bracing, see below.

Decarbonization helps 50/50. But in any case, before repairing the engine, it is worth trying to decarbonize it. The event is quite inexpensive (mere pennies compared to repairs), and it won’t hurt, that’s for sure. If you're lucky, compression will be restored (possibly even for a long time), it all depends on how badly the engine is worn out. In case of severe overheating, decoking will not help.

The engine knocks while driving: what should the driver do?

When you experience engine knocking, the first thing you need to do is check the engine oil level. The appearance of a knock may well be due to a drop in pressure in the lubrication system. If everything is in order with the level, then at the initial stage it will be necessary to more accurately localize the fault, eliminating possible knocking noises from fuel equipment, drives, attachment pulleys, etc. Next, it is necessary to determine the nature of the knock, and also confirm or refute the fact that it intensifies under load. If, as the load on the internal combustion engine increases, the engine knocks more strongly, then most likely the problems have arisen in the crankshaft and the CPG.

If the knocking frequency is two times different from the crankshaft rotation speed, then problems with the timing belt are likely. This is because the crankshaft rotates twice as fast as the camshaft. Warming up the engine in such a case can lead to increased knocking, since with increasing temperature the valve clearances increase. As for the load on the internal combustion engine, the knock of the gas distribution mechanism usually does not depend on the operating mode of the engine. An exception may be hydraulic compensators, which knock more intensely under load.

When knocking occurs on a cold or hot engine, that is, depending on the temperature, you need to additionally take into account the possible expansion of worn parts as they warm up and a decrease in clearances (the knocking weakens). At the same time, the dilution of the heated oil can lead to increased knocking. The first case is typical for CPG, the second affects the bearings of the crank mechanism.

Based on the conclusions drawn about the nature of the knock, you can decide whether to go to the service center on your own or call a tow truck. Finally, we would like to add that increased knocking under load and its rapid progression when driving is a clear sign that it is better to refuse independent movement. In this case, the engine should be turned off to prevent further destruction of the power unit.

Solution options

In fact, there are several of them.

Contacting the dealership

In the event of a visit to the dealer, there is, as a rule, no clear solution to the issue of knocking from under the hood of the Lada Vesta. It all depends on the specific salon. Some centers simply refuse to replace them, citing the fact that this is not a warranty case. Others sent information about the defect directly to AvtoVAZ, but this is a rather lengthy procedure, and therefore not everyone agrees to wait that long. And the answer is not always positive.

Many dealers refuse to replace the airbag under warranty.

But even if the dealer agrees to make a replacement, things don’t always go smoothly. The fact is that often a part is replaced with a similar one, although managers in the salon assure that it is already from a different batch. The result is the same - literally after a few thousand kilometers the sound returns.

However, some owners note that they had reinforced supports installed, after which the problem disappeared.

Independent actions

Do-it-yourself Lada Vesta engine mount replacement

Some car owners who have encountered a knocking noise from under the hood of their Lada Vesta decide to replace the support themselves, so as not to waste time traveling to the dealer and waiting for AvtoVAZ’s decision.

Sometimes you have to change the support yourself

The process itself is not too complicated and we will look at it in a separate article. However, in this case it all depends on the part purchased.

Sometimes the source of knocking under the hood of a Lada Vesta is not the support itself, but the bolt that secures it. Moreover, according to some owners, if you simply tighten it, the knock will soon be heard again. In this case, you have to add a grower.

Using Lubricant

As practice and numerous attempts to solve the problem have shown, getting rid of the knocking noise under the hood of the Lada Vesta is quite simple. It is necessary to lubricate the support itself with silicone grease - directly in those areas where the rubber of the support comes into contact with the metal. Some people use WD-40 liquid for this, but it is not recommended to use it, as it washes out too quickly - it lasts literally for a day.

After this manipulation, the knocking stops, which is recorded on video.

Source